Review our England itinerary plus help w/Warwick - yay or nay
Hi ETBDers!
Our family of four has a 21 night England trip planned for next July. We are mom/dad + 11 & 8 yr old girls. Parents have been to Italy & London/Bath before, plus a ETBD Best of Europe tour. This is the first time over the pond for the kids. We will be renting apts. to have a kitchen and washer/dryer. We want to go by train instead of renting a car.
Here's what I have so far:
Overnight IAD-LHR
Train to Bath (seems faster than taking the bus, but let me know)
4 nights Bath: Roman Baths, governor's walking tour, full day Mad Max Stonhenge/Avebury/Castle Combe tour, free day to pick from additional Bath sights plus time to recover from jetlag
Here's what I need help with: (See part 2 - sorry long post!)
Jennifer
Northern Virginia 10/3/12
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After Bath we could take the train to Warwick to spend 1 night and see the castle and then have 3 nights in York. Or we could skip Warwick and have 4 nights in York (new to everyone in the family). York sights we want to do: Train museum, Viking Ctr, Cathedral, old town, plus maybe go to the coast and/or the Moors for a day (recommendations for best coast city?)
Then we will be in London for 12 nights w/an apt. near High St. Kensington tube. I will list our desired sights to see if Warwick Castle would be duplicating the other sites we're seeing.
London definite: Tower, British Museum, Science Museum, Windsor Castle, Legoland, Harry Potter Studio, Hampton Court, Globe, Tate Modern, St Paul's Cathedral, Churchill War Rooms, Westminster Abbey, London Eye (must do on the kids' list), Free time for parks/shopping/rest.
Other possible London sites: Kew, History/V&A Museums
We thought about Edinburgh for this trip, but it didn't interest us as much as the other sites we have planned. Similarly, we don't have many 'country' days planned b/c our 'wow' nature sites run more along the Alps, Rockies, beach, Italian coast, etc. vs. the bucolic Great Britain scenery.
Thanks for any tips/advice!!
If you do go to Warwick it is a very easy day trip from London. I wouldn't get involved in just arranging one overnight there with all the logistics involved, better to add the overnight to London.
I went to Warwick Castle a couple of years ago on a London Walks Explorer Day which they combined with Stratford on Avon. As you probably know it is owned by the same outfit that owns Madame Tussauds and is increasingly commercial. After you pay the basic entry fee there are further add on fees if you want to visit some of the other parts of the Castle. I guess the precise information is all on the website.
I didn't love Warwick Castle, it was OK but I wont be planning on going again. But many others really like it. + I believe there are often lots of activities planned that suit children, especially in the summer - check their website.
Personally, I think Hampton Court Palace is much more interesting (and it also has activities suitable for children especially the kitchens). You could also think about travelling part of the way there or back using the river boat (say Hampton Court to Richmond on the way back) - using the river boat for the whole trip takes hours.
We visited Warwick Castle in 2004 with our boys and enjoyed walking around the castle walls, especially as there was an orchestra practicing for a concert that evening so our walk was serenaded all the way. I do agree that parts are rather commercial (like cut-rate Disney), but it was nice as part of a day that included Stratford . I don't think I would devote a whole day to it.
Warwick Castle's a carnival. My kids thought it sucked. Wife II likes the town for the antique jewelry shops. The town has a statue of a dead boxer or wrestler. Not much else to say about it.
I had read about the commercial aspect of Warwick, so that was part of my hesitation. I didn't want to go into castle overload either, since we will also be seeing the White Tower, Windsor & Hampton Ct., not to mention all the churches. But I did think it would be nice to see a castle in a more rural setting as well.
Good suggestion to do it as a day trip from London. We're going to try and stay flexible on what we do when, so we can put that in our maybe pile.
Any further suggestions on day trips from York? Is 4 nights there overdoing it? (but our bare minimum stay is 3 nts - just not too fond of the 1-2 nt stays)
In Warwick you can also (usually) climb the tower of St. Mary's Church, which has very good views of the town and the castle from the top. Inside the church you can also do brass rubbing, and visit the crypt where the Earls of Warwick were traditionally buried. Warwick itself is quite small, and has a compact semi-pedestrianised town centre. There are some interesting shops and restaurants there, as well as a small town museum (last time I went it was free entry - but that was 5 or so years ago). It's also easy to get to Stratford-upon-Avon from Warwick - either by train or bus. There have been some archaeological digs at the Shakespeare house recently (my mother has been involved as a volunteer) and I know that people have been to see the dig / volunteered to participate (including an American professor from Oregon I think). Warwick is also contiguous with the town of Leamington, which is far less touristy that Warwick, but is bigger. Leamington grew as a Spa town in the 19th Century and has some pretty Regency buildings, as well as the restored Pump Rooms, which has a small museum in showing the Spa Baths as they were in the 19th Century.
Whether or not you want to visit Warwick Castle comes down to whether or not you want to go somewhere that is rather commercialised, but is different to other castles in its content. You can easily spend several hours there, but as other posters have pointed out, there are extra charges for some of the sights (the Ghost Tower is one I think). Otherwise, you could do a trip to Warwick etc without the castle, but personally, I'd go to York.
Hm, the first part of my post wasn't posted. Gremlins probably.
You can also go to Kenilworth for a different castle experience - Kenilworth Castle is ruined, but quite striking. Its also far cheaper (but also far less developed as a tourist site) than Warwick Castle. You can get to Kenilworth easily from Warwick or Leamington.
Any questions about Warwick, feel free to send me a message - I live around 1 mile from Warwick Castle so I know the town pretty well.
All kids are different, glad my kids have never found anything in Europe to "suck" as they are not jaded world travellers, lol
My 13 yr old loved Warwick Castle , most especially the jousting show, I thought they did a great job of it too.
I am a big fan of York, but even for me 2 days to throughly see the town (within the walls) is enough. the moors are definitely worth extra time(especially if you rent your own car). i prefer the moors to the seasidee- unless you are aiming at a typical British seaside resort experience.
I enjoyed Warwick Castle before it was so commercialized, but would definitely vote for Hampton Court- so much to see in the house and gardens. If you are doing Kew- i would suggest boat back from Kew rather than from Hampton Court, the ride is shorter from Kew, but easily long enough to enjoy the experience.
Definitely see Stonehenge and Avebury. they will linger in your mind for the rest of your life.
See, everyone is different, I thought Stonehenge was just "ok"..
I like Warwick castle a lot. So some of the events connected are a little "cheesy"! I enjoy seeing demos of long-bow vs cross-bow use. I enjoyed the museums within the castle. When I was last there events were staged throughout the day, demonstrating medieval activities. The castle appears intact and is in a setting isolated from the town.
And there is the living quarters demo of a 1890s house party. I loved the realistically-displayed wax figures of famous people including Churchill as a young man, the Prince of Wales and his son, the rooms as they might have appeared then.
The walk into town is easy and pleasant. In fact, I stayed in Warwick and took daytrips from there for several days. Coventry is a bus ride away, as are Stratford-upon-Avon and several Cotswold villages.
To get a train to Bath, I think you'll have to first go into London and then turn around in Paddington for a train to Bath. There is a bus that goes from Heathrow directly to Bath. I think that in the end the bus will be faster.
We spent two nights and one day in Bath and it was plenty. Add a day for the Mad Max tour and you're covered. If you are interested, the best evensong I've heard in GB is in Wells which is about a 45 minute bus ride from Bath. The cathedral has excellent accoustics and the setting is very intimate.
I was looking at the train vs bus schedules and from what I found, it seemed like it took slightly over 2 hrs on the train going through Paddington, but on the bus it was almost 4 hours!
Re: Warwick and the shows - my girls really like that kind of role play/demonstrations (Williamsburg, Quebec City museums that had dress up, etc.) So I'll have to think about it further!
Heathrow to Bath:-
For the bus you need to make sure you get a direct service, not the one that changes at Bristol. That way the journey will be about 2.5 hours (it does vary across the day, minimum 2 hrs, maximum 3 hrs).
For railway you say "the train going through Paddington", so I thought I should check you realise you need to change trains at Paddington (Heathrow to Paddington by either Heathrow Express (15 mins), Heathrow Connect (25 mins). or Underground (about 1 hr, with an extra change at Earls Court).). Once you are at Paddington, the journey to Bath is only 90 mins.
Personally, I'd do the Heathrow Express/Paddington-Bath route (though this will be the most expensive option).
Booking in advance will save you money and in the case of the bus is advisable anyway (especially if arriving afternoon/evening), as it can be very busy.
And just to add to your options, you could consider getting a car service from Bath to come and pick you up. Much easier than the other options. It will be more costly, but with four of you travelling perhaps not that much so compared to the Heathrow Express-Paddington-Bath option (perhaps £130 for the car?). I've not done it for a few years, but "airportspecialists.co.uk" and "countycars.net" both seem to be still in business (the latter could do with some work on its web design though!).
And some general comments:
Bath - four days is quite a lot, but you are obviously planning some trips out and want a day to relax from the flight. If you do find yourself at a loose end, I suggest going across to Bristol (only 20 minutes away). It's my favourite city in the south - the ss Great Britain is very worth seeing and the whole harbourside area is interesting (to me anyway). The Georgian House Museum is good too.
Warwick - I like both the town and the castle - and when they were your childrens' ages, ours really enjoyed the castle (much preferred it to yet another ruined monastry or some sliver of castle left standing once Olly Cromwell had passed through - though when teenagers they did go off Warwick and decided it was "childish"). Sure, Warwick is a bit of a "castle theme park" (it is owned by the same people who own Tussauds after all), but it is fun. However, my reservation about your plan of visiting as an overnight stop from Bath to York is the travel. Neither Bath to Warwick, nor Warwick to York are ideal journeys by rail - both need at least two changes. I'd suggest keeping Warwick but as a day trip from London.