non-tour types considering RS tour
My husband and I have never done a tour for all the usual reasons. However, we are considering the 7 days in Paris tour with RS as it is our first time in France and we do not speak French (tho we will learn conversational French before going in any event) and we want to see a lot with a minimum of hassle. Comments by others who are like us who have taken RS tours would be welcome! Our biggest concerns are the "herd" experience and "that one person" who just won't behave. ;.)
Kara
Albuquerque, NM USA 10/17/12
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I have taken 5 RS tours and when I started was NOT a 'tour' person. But when I couldn't find folks to travel with me I found this a great alternative. I can't say I've ever met anyone who was really obnoxious (unlike the river cruise I took this spring.) The groups are not large, the guide tries to ensure everyone gets acquainted, hotels are good (if you like small RS family hotels)and meals are great. People on RS tours have much in common. My tours consisted mainly of over age 50, retired and still working professional folks who watch public television and like the RS travel philosophy. You have plenty of free time and as long as the guide knows you are not going to be joining the group you don't have to stay with the 'herd.' For instance, in Florence I had already been to the Uffizi and knew what I wanted to concentrate on, so I just told the guide and went off on my own after we entered. And, in Paris, I went with the tour because the guide was so good, but when the group left I stayed, had lunch and explored more on my own. BTW, the conversational French will really help and remember to always greet people when you enter stores, etc. The French are reserved and believe in good manners and appreciate you trying to learn a few words (which they will probably help you pronounce....heehee).
Kara,
I tend to prefer solo travel, but I've been combining this with a RS tour for the last several years and have found that's been a fantastic combination. I've now taken six RS tours, and plan to take more. I can't imagine travelling with any other tour company.
As others have mentioned, RS tour members tend to share a similar travel philosophy, and all of the groups I've toured with have been great. After all, Rick doesn't allow any "grumps"! You may find it helpful to order the free Tour DVD, as that will provide some idea on what the tours are like.
With the city tours, you won't be using a Bus so the experience will be a bit different than the longer tours. I've found that the "pace" of the tours has been good, although there are occasionally some very "busy" days. The Guides are very flexible, and if there's a particular activity you want to skip, just let them know.
One suggestion since this is your first trip to France. Have you also considered a slightly longer tour, perhaps the Paris & Heart of France 11-day tour? This would provide a glimpse of the beautiful scenery, culture and foods in a wider part of the country. You'd also see some really interesting sites, including the D-Day beaches and Monet's Gardens.
It's definitely a good idea to learn some of the polite words in the local language, as the French seem to appreciate that. I haven't had too many language problems there. You'll problem find that anyone in tourist-related businesses will be able to function to some extent in English. Be sure to avoid slang and contractions, and try to speak slowly and clearly.
Happy travels!
As a non-tour person who did a tour (not RS) a couple of years ago, I thought I'd offer you my opinions, for what they're worth. We are very experienced independent travelers, but decided on a tour for Turkey for reasons of language and general lack of cultural familiarity. We had a fabulous guide, who certainly enhanced our experience; and we saw some great things we probably would have omitted, had we been on our own. We were transported efficiently between sites, so wasted no time getting around. The one obnoxious person was annoying, but nothing we couldn't all handle. The downside was that we were not in charge of our time. Not only did we have to get up and get going by someone else's schedule, but we couldn't linger where we wanted to spend more time. We also spent quite a bit of time at a couple of places that didn't interest us at all. In retrospect, those considerations are very important to us. My conclusion is that while I might do another tour someday (we're considering a Dalmatian Coast cruise), I'll mostly avoid tours. I think these pluses and minuses would apply to any tours; however, being in just one city would make it possible for you to leave and rejoin the group at will. On the other hand, Paris is very easy to do on your own, and it's the place in France where you're most likely to find people who speak English. On our first couple of trips to France, we spoke no French, and I don't recall that we had any serious problems.
As a single I have found the RS tours great. I did Rome this year and it was perfect for me. The mornings were organized and we then we were let loose on our for lunch and the afternoon and sometimes the evening. Yes there were some things I would like to have lingered over, but then that is my excuse for going back to Rome! I liked the fact that we used public transportation all the time; I now feel confident about taking the bus and metro in Rome by myself. And on the 3 RS tours I have done there were no Grumps!
An experienced, independent, international traveler, I have also been on two tours (Costa Rica and China, neither RS). I, too, had qualms about the "herd" experience, but both experiences were wonderful. We had no one in the group who was a pain (at least for more than a day, and everyone has bad days). I agree with the previous poster who said that places that they didn't think they got enough time in became a reason to go back again. Having your housing, transportation, meals (at least some), and entertainment taken care of without ever getting lost, or being late, or worrying about parking, was very freeing. And you can see a lot with a minimum of hassle, as you hope to do.
I just returned from Europe where I took my 10th RS Tour. My wife has gone on all of they with me after first declining due to the fact that she had gone to Europe twice before me but decided to tag along even tho she was not thrilled about "touring". She says RS tours are really "un-tours" compared to the tours most folks have taken or heard about. When "penciling out" the costs of what you get on all RS tours, they seem like a bargain to us. If you can swing the extra 4 or 5 days, I would also recommend taking the tour that another poster has mentioned. We took it and enjoyed it.
Thanks to everyone for their time, thoughts, and suggestions. This is such a wonderful message board! I think we've decided to try the 7 day RS tour in Paris and then spend a week or more on our own in southern France.
Kara, I am a fairly experienced independant international traveller( not based overseas on business or service),, and I have only taken one RS tour, but my experience was that it was great. Anyone is free to participate in a days touring or not , I opted out twice and did stuff on my own, just met the bus later or met back at hotel for dinner. The usual set up ran like this for the tour I did, first day in a city , orientation tour , a few highlights, then some free time, then next day was often a free day, but guide usually offered a few suggestions for those who didn't already have some idea of what they wanted to do.. many of us did though since RS travellers tend to be the type that do a bit of homework.. not waiting for our luggage to be delivered to the room and spoon fed every second.
The philosophy of a RS tour is they are teaching you how to travel, they show you how to use the public transport system, they explain some local customs and the local cultures and manners expected, and then off you go . Sometimes a few people would decide to get together and share some time seeing a sight, sometimes not.
I never felt herded. Yes, you can't be late for the bus, you are expected to be respectful of the others on the tour , and you are not entitled to be a "grump".
I suggest you order the free tour dvd , its rather outdated , but the spirit of the tour experience is pretty accurate.
@pat,
I believe there's now a brand new Tour DVD that was just released in the last month or two. As I recall, there are some "clips" in the tours section of this website, as well as the full length version.
Cheers!
From a purely money point, a tour in one city is excessively wasteful. Cost on the website - $2195 each, or $4390. You each get for free:
RS Paris guidebook - $20
RS Phrase book - $9
moneybelt - 2 x $20
Not sure why you would need more than one guidebook and one phrasebook, so doing it yourself would cost $69.
hotel for 6 nights with breakfast included. You can do it yourself for $200 a night. $1200
half your dinners - so 3 dinners for 2 people would cost you about if you dine at these restaurants yourself. 6 x $30 = $180.
Paris museum pass - 69 euro each, about $180.
Transportation pass for 5 days - $81 each or $162.
Bus tour - 2 day hop on hop off is 26 euro each, or $70.
With my bad math that comes out to $1861. We'll round up for errors and call it $2000. Instead of $4390. So you're paying $2390 for what exactly? To be led around by a guide?
Maybe I can buy into it if you were travelling multiple countries with multiple languages (not really), or if it's a guide in a potentially dangerous situation (Himalayas), or if it's your own private guide (not really) but for Paris, where you can easily have a good time speaking ZERO French...
I've been on 7 RS tours. Two were city tours. I had visited those cities before and found that the tours there were probably not worth the extra expense and not that fun.
"Herding" is not so much the problem, but if you aren't using a tour largely for the socializing experience, don't go. It is true that you can omit some activities, but shared meals and introducing each other will create social events that are not appreciated by all. Also, if you go as a "single" and don't pay the single supplement, you may have a roommate you would rather not share space with. Been there, done that.
Having said all that, I would take another RS tour if it is to a new area for me, and if I pay a single supplement. I've had my eye on the Basque tour for a couple of years.
I liked most of the people on tours and found that there was nobody "who just won't behave." Some behavior not to my liking? Yes. Intolerable? No. I've always found fellow tourists I liked.
I went my own way during free time usually. The hotels and meals are a couple of notches higher than what I would experience while traveling on my own. I can appreciate a little luxury.
an hour behind schedule due to Joe and Gladys forgetting where to meet the bus
Was that on a Rick Steves' tour? None of my tour guide friends have mentioned a story like that...
Maybe on a big bus tour?
From the positve comments here I see that a tour does include a certain amount of flexibility, and it's interesting to read the informative experiences of those having participated in tours. As pointed out certain advantages do come with a tour.
Still, the only places I can see myself as part of a tour in Europe is one going to Russia and the Ukraine. That is obvious.
James,
Many thanks for the time you took to run the numbers. Wow! I can think of a lot of other uses for that money. We've traveled all over Italy with very basic language skills. Why not Paris??? This has been a really informative string, and now I think my husband and I will have to give some real thought to how important it is to have someone else think/make decisions for us! Thanks to all.
I have never been on a RS tour (or any other organized tour). So I can't share an opinion.
But this is just a personal observation. In Paris restaurants, tables are so close together that on many occasions I have ended up in coversation with the people sitting next to me, often locals. They have been such pleasant experiences for me. I just wonder if you don't miss out on that kind of experience when you are traveling and dining as a group...
Our tour was held up about 30 min when a couple of our group members got lost trying to find the parking lot after visiting Pisa. The one woman got lost another time or two on her own time. One of our RS guides "forgot" her luggage when we left a hotel and we were held up at least an hour while she got on the phone and contacted the hotel about forwarding her bag. No names need to be mentioned. I think the guide had expected her fellow-guide to bring her luggage to the bus, but we never got a full explanation.
Stuff happens. I got sick a couple of days into one RS tour and remained ill, missing large parts of the tour. On my first tour in 2000, a man on the tour collapsed on the bus the first day. We got to see how the French medical system works. Our assistant guide accompanied the man to the nearest ER where thorough medical studies were done. The man and guide joined us later and all was fine. The ER docs had done a battery of tests on the man and said he was fit to travel. There was no charge for any of his tests and treatment.
When I'm on a tour I go around on my own time and meet people the way I would if traveling alone. It is possible to have the best of both forms of travel if you put some effort into it. Many tour members just want to be carried around, do no research, and still have a good time. Some tour members get really creative in the use of their free time, including going to a bull fight or catching a train/bus to another town for the day.
Hi Kara, my husband & I were in France for 2 weeks this summer (5 days in Paris), traveling by ourselves. We did go on two RS tours several years ago - enjoyed both of them.
I would definitely recommend for a Paris week that you tour on your own. Pick up the RS Paris book and look at the recommended historical walks, etc. and you're good to go.
Language - We were very courteous and found that Parisians were cordial in return - never experienced problems with our very, very basic attempts to speak French.
Be sure to reserve your ticket on-line to the Eiffel Tower; it will save you a lot of time. We used the Metro exclusively, buying two carnet of tickets (have coins available for purchase) and loved the ability to hop on and walk all over. We bought the 4-day museum pass, so we had the flexibility to not cram museums into two days - good decision.
Enjoy - it's a beautiful city! ....and the croissiants are fantastic!
You need to see for yourself what is important to you. Have never been on a tour and am too frugal (cheap) to do it and too independent. That said, have made many trips to Paris and all over France and still can't speak more than basic hello, thank you and have never had a problem with the language. Have encountered people who don't speak English and they were more than willing to help when we were lost, they simply found someone who was able to translate for us. Don't let language barrier stop you. I would get Rick's books on ETBD and specifically one on just Paris if he has one and that may help. Enjoy whatever your decide.
Kara,
While the numbers provided by James are one aspect of the question, another point to consider is what "intangible" benefits would be provided by a tour. I find that I learn far more about the history and culture while on a tour, and that provides a much more rewarding and interesting travel experience. That's one reason I continue to take tours and my latest trip to Sicily was no exception. Given the sites that we visited (with excellent local Guides), I felt that the trip was good value.
One reason I mentioned considering one of the longer tours, is that would not only provide a good overview of Paris but also provide a glimpse of a different part of France. If you arrived a few days prior to the tour, you'd be able to visit sites in Paris that aren't included.
You may find it interesting to read the Tour Reviews of the tour you're considering, to see what others have said about it. Click the "Tours" tab at the top of the page.
Cheers!
I've always been curious... how does RS keep "grumps" from joining a tour?
We have never taken a Rick Steves tour, but if we were going to take a tour it would probably be one of his. I went with another company to Spain in 2005 and would not repeat. We always travel with Rick's books in Europe since 2003, probably about eight or nine trips over by now. All of the above said, I don't think the value added is there for a city tour in a city as easy as Paris. It's truly one of the easiest big cities in Europe to visit. The trade-offs would not make it worth it for my wife and me, though of course you have to decide based upon your preferences. I can see doing a RS tour for Turkey though, assuming we wanted to go beyond Istanbul. I would also consider a tour in some locations where independent travel would be more of a challenge (for example, China), although Rick does not go there. For us the trade-offs of a lot of structure, possible lack of ability to linger, and the extra expense steer us away from tours. A tour would be great when you are covering a lot of ground going to hard-to-reach places. But the metro and buses in Paris are so easy. We did cross paths with a Rick Steves tour group in Ruette, Austria in 2006 and they seemed to be having a great time. Also, it was a really nice group of people and we chatted at some length with the tour guide who was very personable. If you do take a tour, a Rick tour is a very good bet.
Susan , good question, but they seem to, basically the tour information is so clear on expectations. You don't take a RS tour if you want alot of luxury or service, you will carry your own bag , you will walk ..and they frankly just say "no grumps allowed",, that may scare off some prima donna types.
Thanks Pat :)
I do hope someday to take a RS tour. Reading the Scrapbooks convinced me.
I met some members of a group of RS tour travelers when I was in Assisi and I've never seen a happier group of people. They were on their own for the day and had all the RS maps/guides and a plan. Grumps who are self-aware don't sign up for these tours, I guess. There might also be some peer pressure to relax and have a good time - sounds like a great tour idea to me.
Having been on 2 RS tours and loving them, my advice is flip your planning around and do the week in Paris on your own, take one of the RS tours thru the countryside. The math given earlier seems plausible. To address the flip side of the coin, "what do you get" question is easier to answer for tours covering multiple cities.
On your own its easy to underestimate the time it takes to get from city to city; you need to check out, go to the car lot, drive (and not get lost!), find the new hotel, check in, etc. By public transit you still need to get to the station, and now their schedule is your schedule. On our own it takes at least 1/2 day to move just an hour drive away when all is said and done. On a tour you walk into the hotel, they hand you your room key, done. The bus is waiting when the group departs and take you right to the new hotel, and the driver worries about parking it. Furthermore its a task to learn your way around several cities, but with a guide you go quickly and easily between points of interest. Overall I'd say it takes 2.5 to 3 days to do on your own what you do in 2 days on a tour.
Factored that way, the cost becomes much more reasonable on multi-city tours. on a single-city tour I don't think it is the same; after a day or so you'll learn to get around Paris pretty well.
I'd add that the guides are something else I think adds real value. You can easily do this on your own in Paris (Paris Walks is wonderful!) but this can be hard to do in smaller cities that may not have public tours you can join and where you'd have to hire an expensive private guide.
Lastly, RS uses the same "tour" math everyone else uses; his 7-day trip is really 5.5 at best since you meet at 3pm the 1st day and the tour ends at breakfast on the 7th. So the price in a sense is even higher than the breakdown given earlier.
To address your original herd question, you get plenty of free time. We only did multi-city tours, but on those the protocol was generally a half-day with the group and a half-day on your own on days we stayed in the same city, or a 1/2 day or so on the bus and a few hours with the group on transport days.
I would disagree with the post(s) saying people show up prepared. Ours of course is a limited sample, but I got the strong impression virtually nobody had opened the book before the trip. Nothing stops you from reading and planning ahead, from getting RS and other videos from the library to watch before your trip, and I'd strongly recommend doing so if you go on a RS tour so you can plan in advance what you'd like to do and see on your own, some restaurants you'd like to visit that got great reviews, etc. In that vein, there is a company called the "Teaching Company" that makes (expensive) CDs and DVDs although they regularly go on sale and your local library may stock some. Before going to Paris I watched one about the Louvre in which an art expert explained what to look for in a sampling of the works. I thought I had much more appreciation for them when I finally saw them. They also have a series about Art Appreciation, about Cathedrals, about Impressionism, etc.
I would not consider an RS tour ( or any other) in most parts of Europe simply because I don't see them as a good value for my travel dollars. They are rather pricey - the 7 day Paris is about $800/day per couple. (Day 1 starts at 3 pm and Day 7 ends at breakfast - so by my math it's not even a full 5.5 days.) I can do a lot more and have many more days of travel if I travel independently, and make my own plans and arrangements.
That said, there are parts of Europe where I do not want to be on my own, forgive my pre-conceptions, like Turkey or Russia. For those destinations, I become a tour-person.
One other thing about the RS tours as opposed to most other tours,, they have a no tipping policy for guide.. which is different then most tours( but not all I assume) Tips can add up , and the no tipping thing does make a difference. Of course you can't apply that math to travelling independently, but just saying, RS tours do not nickel and dime you like some cheaper tours.
Just finished my first RS tour and thought it was great. Been to Europe many times without a tour also. For a tour in Paris I would just do it on my own.
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