How rude are the French?
My husband and I are going on a Rick Steve's tour that starts in Paris (neither of us have been to Europe or Oversees before!). We are flying in two days early and I want to go see a few things that are not included in our tour. (like the Eiffel Tower) I have told a few people that I know have traveled to Paris about our plans and everyone has commented on how rude and not helpful the French are. I am wondering if this is a generalization or is there a way I can prepare in order to have a better experience!
Thank You!
Nicole
Denton, Tx USA 11/12/12
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Never met a Parisian as rude as Ralph, who posted earlier in this thread, and he seems to be from Germany. Luckily, I don't assume everyone in Germany is rude because of him.
So rudeness is universal, there are jerks everywhere, It is up to you if you let the few bad apples ruin your experience. (and yes, there are rude people in Atlanta, just try driving here)
"For what it's worth, if you are first to show the slightest inclination to give way on crowded sidewalks...well, that's a sign of weakness".
How true. I never noticed this traveling around France until I got to Paris. I spent a month there this summer and walked the streets a lot and often ran into groups coming towards me and they didn't move aside at all to let me pass so I had to step around, one time even into the street to get around them. After a couple of times I thought to myself, well that's pretty rude. The next time it happened I just decided I was going to keep on walking and if they didn't move and I walked right into them, oh well, so be it. Amazingly it worked. You don't have to make eye contact, just keep your head up and keep walking. I guess it's not necessarily "rude", just what they are used to.
Other than that I found the people all around France and even in Paris, as a rule, were very polite and helpful. I do agree that a few words/phrases of French go a long way toward eliciting that politeness.
As for the "bonjour" and "au revoir", it's expected even at street market stalls not just shops. I got so used to it after a month that I even said bonjour to the passport clerk when I got back to the States, he looked at me and I explained it was getting to be a habit, he just laughed.
As has been said above, the big trick is to learn a few words of French and be big on the Bon jours as well as please and thank you. If you make any kind of an effort they will meet you half way or better. I think it is in Rick's book that I read that they just don't trust strangers who smile a lot, they have been invaded by too many of them.
Just wear good walking shoes and take it as it comes, Paris is a beautiful city that I was prepared to dislike and I am looking forward to going back for a third time. Nonetheless it is a big city and all big cities have their ways. A thought on the Eiffel Tower is that if the lines for the elevators are too long, it does not cost much to climb up the stairs to the lower level and the view from there is quite good.
Have fun.
Carol, Ralph is an American working in Germany.
You will be fine!
That type of prejudice is pretty universal. Some Americans think the French are rude but if you ask French people they sometimes believe that Americans are friendly but have no manners.
Overall, I almost always had a good experience in France. I speak French fluently though and sometimes while speaking English to my wife, I overheard pretty mean things being said behind our backs which I found disappointing.
To be honest even when I speak French in France, I try to speak with a neutral French accent because a Swiss or Belgian accent is an invitation to sarcasm and jokes (not rude per se, just tiring).
I always found the example of the failure of WalMart in Germany interesting to illustrate the cultural difference with Europe. Shoppers were turned off by WalMart staff hired to greet them at the door and bag their groceries. Germans didn't want strangers handling their groceries. And when clerks followed orders to smile, male customers took it as a come-on.
Mark, thats funny in that I recall the EuroDisney( outside Paris) had a problem when they first opened outside Pari, teaching the new Disney staff to behave in a Disneyish way, smiling, gushing, "happiest place on earth way" it did not come to them naturally, it was not their culture. They seem to have it down now mind you, but as I said, I recall it was something they had to be taught.
Bonsoir! I'm French and am always very happy to read those nice comments so thank you all! Bon voyage Nicole and welcome to France, I'm sure you'll have a good time.
I've just read an interesting topic about a French student's manners which you may enjoy :
http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowTopic-g187070-i12-k5899660-Manners_in_France-France.html
Merci encore! :)
Pat, you are absolutely right. I have been to Euro Disney and the staff has a tough time with the Disney code of conduct. Smiling is not seen as appropriate in a business context or transaction and can be interpreted as flirtatious.
To the Germans, sorry we sent you Ralph to represent us. I assumed he was from Germany based on his location. But I think he proves my point. Rudeness is universal. Even on here. (Sorry Ralph, but your prejudiced statements about the Parisians was rude IMHO, it was not direct as it was not based in fact but on your prejudice LOL! As for telling me to "mind my own business" once you put your fingers on a keyboard and post on a public message board you give up that "privacy" right. Feel free to attack my grammar and spelling. I don't really mind :) )
If you let it get to you, you will react and "ATTACK" people or entire cultures (AKA the Parisians) using prejudice to make your point
If you roll with the punches, the "rude" won't' be an issue because you won't fixate on them.
And of course if you are polite that always helps. At least some of the "rude" I hear about occurs because the "complainer" was rude. I travel a lot. The "Rude" gate agent at the airport was "rude" after the passenger SCREAMED at him/her because it was all his/her fault that they arrived late and the plane left LOL! See that type of "complaint" all the time. In other words if you abuse folks, don't expect them to like it!
Exactly right Carol.
Yes , but Ralph that seems to apply to you,, "freedom speach does not protect...."
You weary some of us with your pretentions,, referring to a quote but not posting it, ( the purpose being ,affecting seeming non chalance, "oh, doesn't everyone know that quote by old jim") yeah yeah yeah,, google is a game two can play. .
Thank you for all of your information!! I did not mean to offend anyone. I will brush up on my French, become familiar with the subway system and look into a volunteer person?
Thank you for your help! I did read Europe Through the Backdoor and can't wait to get my books from Rick Steve's Tour. We are going on the 14 day Europe tour. This is a huge trip for my Husband and I.
Any thoughts on what the weather will be like in May?
Thanks,
Nicole
Jeez, people, lighten up. You've sidetracked this thread enough.
Nicole, I believe that the unfriendliness of the French is similar to the reputation of unfriendly NYC residents: might have been true 50 years ago, hasn't been true in my experience. The single exception in 3 trips was one crepe seller in the Latin Quarter. He asked where I was from and I said 'Texas'. He scowled at me and said "ohhhh, George Bush, blah blah blah". I smiled and said, "George Bush is not a Texan, he was born elsewhere". I figured, everyone gets to have a bad day sometime.
Have a great time, and read the guidebooks!
Nicole,
The weather should be quite nice in May, but of course there are never any guarantees. Be sure to pack some clothes for "layering" and also some light rain gear. As Rick has remarked on occasion, "there's no such thing as bad weather, just inappropriate clothing".
Cheers!
In a number of short visits to France, I can only think of one experience of rudeness from some probably bored airport workers. On the whole I do not think that rudeness in France is any more common than it is in any other country. I remember being told by a fellow Australian who had worked in rural France, that French country people consider Parisians to be rude. I have had no such experience myself other than the one mentioned above.
"might have been true 50 years ago"
Wasn't true then either.
"might have been true 50 years ago
Wasn't true then either."
To be honest, I went to Paris for the first time 42 years ago and there was then still a tradition of the eternally grumpy and sarcastic Parisian in an almost comical way: The "titi parisien".
A person that would invariably respond "on fait aller" (we make it go) to the "Ça va?/how are you?" question.
rubbish.
I lived there from 1960 to 1965 and know firsthand from personal experience it wasn't true then and it isn't true now.
Not true and rubbish?
Gosh. What a patronizing forum.
I went to school in Grenoble until my baccalaureat and I remember visiting "Les Halles" and other sites. Colorful and fun but pretty abrasive.
Mark you visited, Susan lived there. My first visit was 1972, I was a child , but didn't find anyone rude to me? Perhaps they are only rude to some people ?
Nicole as for weather in May on the tour, it will vary quite a bit, in will be nice in Rome, warm but not roasting hot, but in the mountains in Switzerland it can still be a bit nippy, there may even be snow up on some of the hiking trails. We were there in late July and the locals told us there was snow on some trails still in early June that year.
Bring layers as advised, a rain jacket, a warm sweater or fleece, and most of us, good shoes. For Rome remember you need to have covered shoulders ( so no tank tops or sleeveless sundresses unless you bring a shawl or sweater) and covered knees ( that goes for hubby too) to tour the Vatican. They are strict about that in Italy, not so in France though.
Pat, I have family in Paris and I was many years in Grenoble. I did not mean rude like mean spirited. I was simply referring to a Parisian culture that I really liked. Very funny, irreverent in a good way but that could certainly be construed as abrasive to outsiders. The comedian Coluche or the popular singer Renaud (both Parisians) captured so well that spirit. Waiters in cafes did not hesitate to make fun of their customers etc... I think it is mostly gone as the world becomes homogenized.
New Yorkers aren't rude, but they are often in a hurry. So, when you stop to take a picture of the Chrysler Building in the middle of the side walk at 3rd and 44th at noon, you're going to get a lot of people pushing past you and it may seem rude, but it's our lunch break.
See the TripAdvisor Forum for NYC and you'll see lots of posts from Europeans, Australians, mid-westerners and more about how helpful New Yorkers are. Stand on any corner gazing at a map and in less than a minute some will ask if they can help.
It is the culture difference whether it is NYC or Paris.
Pam
We are US expats living near Amsterdam, and traveled extensively throughout Western France this past summer (as well as most of Western Europe in general). From our experience, I would say I encountered more people in France who were not interested in trying to communicate in anything other than their native language than in many of the other places we visited. That is not to say they are rude, but that we did encounter a lot of people at restaurants and out and about simply had no interest in trying to communicate in anything other than French - most of them in the smaller towns, but some in Paris and the large cities as well. I find this is my biggest problem communicating in Europe in general - most people at least show an interest in trying to communicate, either with hand signals or whatever, but there are those who simply do not have time or want to make the effort to try to figure out a way to communicate. It can be incredibly frustrating. From our experience, we encountered more of those people in France than say, Germany, Denmark, Belgium, the Netherlands...
And, pick pockets are quite real and are incredibly skilled! They often work in teams.
Katie, I am intrigued by your post. You say that in France there were many who "were not interested in trying to communicate in anything other than their native language". As a visitor, were you interested in communicating in other than your native language? Did you ascertain that the people you met actually could speak English but stubbornly refused to? My experience in France is that as you get further away from Paris, fewer French people can speak English. It isn't a matter of "not being interested in trying to communicate" in English. They simply do not speak anything but French, just as many in your country and mine speak only English. Now, since rudeness is the topic of this thread, I leave it to you to decide if it is rude to be unilingual.
"It isn't a matter of "not being interested in trying to communicate" in English. They simply do not speak anything but French, just as many in your country and mine speak only English. Now, since rudeness is the topic of this thread, I leave it to you to decide if it is rude to be unilingual."
Norma making good use of taking quotes out of context to set up a strawman argument. Nowhere did Katie suggest that those who can't speak English are rude. She simply stated that other Europeans are willing to make more of an effort to communicate when there is a language barrier.
"I find this is my biggest problem communicating in Europe in general - most people at least show an interest in trying to communicate, either with hand signals or whatever, but there are those who simply do not have time or want to make the effort to try to figure out a way to communicate."
I'm now going to generalize from limited experience and pose the question - How rude are the Canadians?
"encountered more people in France who were not interested in trying to communicate in anything other than their native language..."
Umm, maybe that's because they are French, live in France, speak French, have 100% of their daily conversations in French, and really have no reason to speak in any other language. And how is this any different than right here in the ole' USA? Even though most Americans will have an interaction with a Spanish speaker somewhere at least once per day, what percentage are not interested in communicating in anything other than English? Answer: 100%. Reminds me of a tee shirt I saw at the Iowa State Fair: Uncle Sam exclaiming, "You're in America...Speak English!" Nice.
Actually, I'll go out on a limb and suggest that the Canadians I know and have met are seriously the nicest people anywhere. I've met and know people from all over...BC to Quebec. While I'm at it, I'll also suggest that folks from Minnesota seem to be about the nicest around, and I've been everywhere. Just my opinion, of course.
I feel like people honestly believe that everyone speaks English and are hiding it. It's simply not true. Especially in France. Sure, they start taking English in their écoles primaire and might on average know a little more English than Americans know French-but think about your experience. Most people in the US start taking language courses in high school. Would you feel comfortable with someone in French talking up to you in Chicago and asking IN French directions. Chances are your high school education flies out the window.
Bottom line, the French are not rude. How can people characterize a group of people? Customs are different in different countries. Embrace it. A world where everything is the same would be a boring one.
Since my post earlier this morning I picked up a book at a garage sale, called "A Short History of Rudeness: Manners, Morals and Misbehavior in Modern America" by Mark Caldwell. I haven't read it yet but the blurb on the back says in part, the author "...gives us a chronicle of the demise of manners and charts the triumphant progress of rudeness in America." So the French seem to have the reputation but we in (North) America may have to step back and look at ourselves, too. Just sayin' ...
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