Comment about tipping
We were recently in Galway (Sept 2012) and had a fabulous dinner at one of the Rick Steves' recommended restaurants. This was an affordable, but upscale place. While paying by credit card, our waiter asked us to key in the amount of our gratuity. We had not been asked to tip in any other restaurant on our travels, and this caught us by surprise. We ended up tipping 15-20 percent. My question: Was he out of line or is tipping more expected in upscale restaurants. Interested in others' experiences. Thank you.
Susan
Dayton, Ohio United States 10/7/12
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Susan, I can't answer your question about Galway, but I can tell you about two incidents in Switzerland. On our first night in Switzerland, in St. Gallen, when we asked if service was included , the waitress was in the middle of telling us "no", when the owner came running over to tell us "yes". Second, we did have the same experience as you in a RS restaurant in Murren, where the waiter pointed to the line on the cc receipt and told us it wasn't included. Although it was included everywhere else, we were stupid enough to leave a tip. BTW, the restaurant wasn't very good. If you find out you were milked for an extra tip, I hope you put it on Trip Advisor, so future customers can enjoy their meal and be forewarned.
With the chip & pin card payment system, it is common in restaurants for you to be given the choice on whether to add a tip to the amount being charged for the meal. It is not compulsory, and some people prefer to tip in cash, as that it way it may go completely to a particular individual. In many restaurants, it s specifically stated that all tips are distributed among all the staff working a particular shift.
Some people never tip. Tipping 15-20 percent would be thought excessive in the U.K., and I doubt if it is different in Ireland. 10% is the standard amount, assuming that the standard of service was acceptable. Some restaurants add a service charge of 10% or 12.5%, in which case no tip is required.
Never tip in a bar or pub.
So Bob is saying that tipping is expected and added later in Great Britain and Ireland, as in the US, unlike in France and Switzerland where it is included. There is a link to a tipping guide someone which hopefully someone will bring up.
While we don't eat at upscale restaurants, we have always been told that in Ireland, tips are not expected. In fact, we were once followed out of a restaurant by a server trying to return the money that we "forgot" on the table. I have had the tip line on a receipt pointed out to me here in the US, in case I want to add a tip to the charge, but I have often left a tip on the table instead, and leave that line blank. If I were in Ireland and had the line pointed out to me, I would not necessarily feel compelled to add something there, since in four trips now, we were told that it wasn't expected.
The server told you that because the tip cannot be added in after the card has been run through the machine, like you use to be able to do in former times. It wasn't a beg for tips. They wanted to save you the hassle of trying to find some change if you didn't have it.
For those of you who believe that a Service Charge on your bill is a replacement for a tip, or that the server receives this money, you are mistaken. The Service Charge goes to the restaurant. They use this to help pay for employee insurance, their vacations, their sick-pay, etc. It never goes to the servers or bartenders, or cooks. When you tip your server, they may also be tipping out a certain percent to the kitchen staff or the bartender.
Does one have to tip? No, you don't, especially if the service was crappy. But if your service was great, then at least a 5-10 % tip is very welcome, especially in large cities, where prices are higher. One doesn't usually leave it on the table either. The tip is given while the server is making change for you when you pay your bill.
Having worked in the restaurant industry here, I do like to offer correct information about things like tipping. Rick has it quite wrong in his books. He probably asked the owner of some family run restaurant in a small town, where things certainly aren't the same as a professional place in a big city. They are nothing alike. I often hear the comment that wait staff is paid a "living wage", so you don't have to tip them. What do you imagine this to be? 5 € an hour, 10 €, or 20 €? What could you live on per hour? Rounding up is also recommended, and often this is ok, but if your bill is 99 €, you certainly would want to tip more than 1 €.
What jo said about the tips having to be added before card is put through is correct, most machines do not have a user add tip option.
However Susan as far as I am concerned if you tipped 20% you grossly overtipped, and I am surprised you didn't know that since you had a RS book which explains that in most places in Europe tipping is just not that extravagant. 10% would have been ample for good service only.
Tipping 5-10% is more the norm in nice restaurants.
Jo: since, "Rick has it quite wrong in his books" would you mind comparing his advice with what you believe to be true and offering all to us?
Bets,
As a Swiss, I am really embarrassed that they made you tip. Of course the tip is included in Switzerland. It is common courtesy to leave a few Francs or some spare change but it is absolutely not required.
Thanks to everyone for their responses. Very helpful. I agree with the post stating that if "Rick has it all wrong" updated guidelines would be helpful. And, yes, after the fact, we knew the tip we left was excessive. At least we can hope our waiter was able to put it to good use. We weren't trying to show off or insult anyone.
In general I'd say tipping American Style is not expected in Europe, but it is common practice in most countries to at least round the amount, say from 46 to 50 and so on.... About 10% in other words.
Tipping 20% is excessively.
A key factor many people ignore is that the base salary for waiters in Europe is much higher than in US, for most of it.
Where some moderate tipping (below 10%) has a place, it can increasingly by done by entering the amount on the credit card machine after or before the password. This is what they were probably trying to explain, more than to "demand" a tip.
Actually, even in places where there are some tipping, it goes nowhere near the practice in most US restaurants where you are just expected to pay 10-15% regardless of whether you really liked the service, and 20% for a "I'm pleased" scenario.
It may be the policy of the restaurant to encourage tipping by card rather than by cash.
In the UK staff must be paid the minimum wage and money from tips and service charges cannot be used as part of this. By a code of practice the restaurant will indicate how tips and service charges are directed, and if there is any deduction made by the restaurant. This is in general in small print on the menu. An example of this is at http://www.caferouge.co.uk/service-charge (not a restaurant recommendation ...).
Some have been campaigning for many years in the UK to make prices required to be service inclusive, as is the case in most other countries in Europe. This is resisted for many reasons, but the prime one at the moment seems to be that discretionary service and tips are not subject to VAT.
In Germany, the basic tarif pay for wait staff that have at least some training is about 9.69 € per hour, gross pay. Subtract their health insurance contribution, the pension contribution and the taxes and a single person with no dependents, will bring home half of that. So, probably less than 5 euro per hour, or about 800 euro per month. So, yes, this is more than in the US, but they still do depend on tips, which they also have to declare for tax purposes.
I have yet to meet a server who was insulted by a high tip. Why would they? I have seen them insulted with a 1 euro tip for a bill of 99 euro though.
Jo, that's almost less than in the US. They don't get benefits (but many qualify for Medicaid and other programs, esp if they have families) at most restaurants, but for example, in WA the minimum wage is 9.04 an hour (and servers get FULL minimum wage) plus tips (standard around here is almost always 20%). Most servers I know walk out with a couple hundred on a good night. The people who really get hit are the other staff (dishwashers and cooks) who don't get tipped.
Germany/Washington...same government.
Well, they don't get full minimum wage in Iowa...they get $4.35 per hour. Some of the best tipped employees working in high-end restaurants anywhere in the country can make decent money, but when you consider the broad range of waitresses/waiters working across the huge expanse of restaurants in any given city in the U.S., it's hardly a wage anyone could live on. I've been educated by others and now try to tip very well when the service is good. I used to tip next to nothing for fair or below service, but again, my favorite dining partner has opened my eyes to the plight of the typical wait person, so now I tip a little bit better, even when the service is uneven. It's no skin off my back to try and help someone else who really does have a crappy job and makes almost nothing. I'm doing well and can afford it. But I admit, I still hate it when I end up with a waiter like that guy at Chotchkie's from the movie Office Space. I'm really not looking for a wait person to be my friend when dining out.
Servers don't get full minimum wage ($8.75) in Illinois, either. Most that I know of (full service pizza/family dining restaurants) get between $4.25-$5.50, and they do depend on their tips. And I know it's hard work, and they can have killer schedules. Having "done my time" years ago (and having kids that have done the same) I'm much more conscious of leaving a good tip.
How many servers in American who make the equivelent of 800 euros a month even HAVE medical insurance,, I bet its like almost none! So they have to pay for their own medical insurance or care, and I bet it would be alot more then the deduction the German servers pay.
While people in higher paying or corporate /business jobs may have medical insurance included as a bonus, we are talking about servers, what I lump in with the "working poor" of American who cannot afford private medical insurance, and yet, do not quailify for medicare.
So, I think its still a way better deal being a server in Germany( and alot of other western Europeon countries) then the States.
PS In Germany post secondary education is ALOT cheaper, or may be free , so nothing like the kids who have to work to pay for expensive educations if their parents can afford to pay for them. A kid working to pay their way through school in America has a tough row to hoe and needs every penny of their tips.
Jo's corrections to Rick's advice would be appreciated given her prior comment that he has it "quite wrong."
While this thread is waivering off topic...I'll add to the waiver by just adding:
Technically all waitstaff in the US make minimum wage. The lower base rate is allowed only if tips make up the difference between the base and the minimum wage rate. Though this may certainly leave the door open for abuse by some on both sides of the equation.
My own feelings about tipping in the US aside, the present system is likely to always be around, it is beneficial for both the restaurant and the wairstaff.
Bringing this back to topic, a tip in Europe is certainly appreciated, but need not be more than a few coins to round up the bill. The exception would be extraordinary service, where a tip equalling a few percent of the bill or so, should be given directly to the waitstaff with a thank you, rather than left on the table.
Unfortunately, in tourist areas, especially with Americans, a hefty tip is almost expected anymore; so that adds a different dynamic to the issue.
Even with a good insurance plan provided by the employer, a typical college-educated, white-collar worker in a big corporation in the U.S. still has to fork out something like $150 per month, a $4000 deductible, and a 15% co-payment to pay for their plan to cover their family. That's easily $6000 - $10,000 per year for most people and we haven't even discussed prescriptions, dental, vision, etc. That's certainly not a bonus. And no way a waitress could do that, not even if her employer offered coverage. Then, consider having two kids who need to attend public university at $25,000 per year or private at $45,000. Your typical American family just can't handle this. They can make it happen, but they're going into big time debt literally for the rest of their lives so their kids can have a better future and realize the American Dream. And this is after they've done all the right things, like having college savings plans in place since birth. If parents simply can't do it, then kids start out in life with a 4 year degree and $200,000 in debt. They'll literally never get out from under that. It's just not right that international corporations are making obscene profits from health care and education at the expense of regular people who are simply trying to make a better life for their families. Definitely, a massive change is in order, but it's never going to happen in this country, ever. Not with Dems or Republicans. Now, if we had the wealth and foresight of Norway, things might be different.
"Unfortunately, in tourist areas, especially with Americans, a hefty tip is almost expected anymore; so that adds a different dynamic to the issue."
So the question then is; Are these Americans leaving hefty tips and setting a new standard (or in other words, messing up an otherwise rational tradition) doing so because they simply don't know any better (typical American behavior "A") or because they are self-righteously imposing their own upbringing on another part of the world (typical American behavior "B")?
And is it just American tourists? Or do tourists from other corners of the world have their own tipping quirks?
Paul how is the present situation benefitting the waitstaff, I know how it benefits the employers, we ( the dining public) are supplementing the wages they should be paying,, but how does this system benefit your servers.. Its funny how your system is not used in SO MANY other countries and yet your countries servers are not better paid or treated.. perhaps you are wrong.. has that ever occurred to you ( I mean the collective you, as in American) ?
Pat, What is the system in Canada? I thought tipping of wait staff was also customary in Canada.
Pat; Yes, the employer benefits by having a lower committed wage, which means they can have more staff on hand, cut staff if things are slow, etc. Waitstaff benefit in that, many, earn on average more than they can could in other jobs with similar skill sets. Add the not so subtle benefit that earnings are in cash and not neccessarily fully reported for taxation, many prefer the arrangement.
As a job, yes, it has it's difficulties (mine does too) but I gather if you were to poll waitstaff and offer a "fair" wage and no tips, most would opt for tips.
Oh yes we tip here, but its not as essential as it is in States( I totally get tipping 20% if a server is making 3 bucks an hour) Wages are still low, its 9 dollars an hour in my province , but better then 3-4$ hr in some states and yes, they still get tipped, but its more like 15% average as opposed to the sometimes 20-25% many Americans are now used to tipping) , and even a server who makes very little money at all can have FREE medical insurance , it just means if you make less then a certain amount|( $22,000) in a year you don't have to pay any medical insurance premuims, and even if you make over 30,000 it still caps out at 64 dollars a month. So a server here has a fighting chance, and as pointed out by Jo a server in Germany has more deductions on their checks, but that includes medical coverage for them also.. a different variation of universal medical coverage for everyone. So though they make 5 euros an hour after deductions, quite a few things are included services for which they are paying taxes on.
I hope Americans one day have a similar plan, I know you have a mediaide of some sort, but I also know that many people fall in between qualifiying for that( being on welfare or destitute,) and being able to pay for private( the working poor, they can pay their rent and food, but no extras at all!).
Thankfully ALL Australians are entitled to and receive free Government funded medical/hospital care. They can also receive free dental care.
I am astounded and find it unbelievable that a country like the USA cannot implement a similar free health system for all its citizens.
Not only is health insurance included in these other countries, but I'm sure there are contributions toward retirement and servers get paid vacation days. Way off the OP question now--sorry Susan. The Genie came out of the bottle.
I have enjoyed all the insights on tipping, the rights of workers and health care. Travel opens our minds, hearts and spirits. Carry on!
Since I have been asked to clarify what I wrote about tipping, though one could have just looked it up in their own blue book, here ya go.
Quotes from Rick about tipping in Germany:
"At German restaurants a service charge is generally included in the bill, although it is common to round up after a good meal"
This tells us that he believes the server is going to get that service charge, which is incorrect. He also writes that "tips are appreciated, if not expected." This is also incorrect. Tips ARE expected, just not in the high percent as what is normal in the US. He needs to talk to some wait staff.
Special services Quotes:
"I don't tip the maid, but if you do, you can leave 1 euro per overnight at the end of your stay". This is incorrect. Do tip the maid on a daily basis as the housekeeping staff may also switch rooms on a daily basis. 1 euro is a kind of cheap too, considering this person just cleaned your toilet and bathtub. People tip a bartender a dollar for pouring a draft beer, but not a housekeeper?
"If I have already paid for a tour, I don't tip extra unless they have really impressed me." The only tour guides I have ever seen holding out their hand for a tip, as Rick quotes, are those who are doing those "free tours". They do depend on your tips, so they can pay the company a fee for each person who began the tour. Easiest, is to just avoid the free tours. It is correct though, to tip a guide who has probably spent years researching their subject, and who has entertained you for a couple of hours.
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